Streetwise Answers
Dear Streetwise
On a recent contract, the Contractors Contract manager agreed to provide some minor items of hired in plant and I agreed that they could deduct the cost from the final account.
They duly provided copy invoices, with which I am in full agreement, but the QS has also added a 20% mark up, justifying this by saying that as I mark up anything I provide, so can he.
Can he do this? Should he be doing this?
The QS has also said that he will only release my final payment if and when I send him a credit for the full amount, including the 20%. I have so far only sent him a credit for the nett amount + VAT.
The Contract Manager has confirmed over the phone today, that he agreed to provide the plant at nett cost, but he has since left the Contractor.
The 20% only amounts to a couple of hundred quid and the final payment is about £10K, but the phrase “thin end of the wedge” comes to mind.
The QS is a blustering, unpopular bully (you probably wont be too surprised to hear!), who I dont get on with. He had to agree in advance to some accelleration costs, to get us to accelerate at very short notice and now says that as I “held him to ransom, its payback time.” I should point out that he passed the acceleration costs onto the client and didnt have to stand them himself!
Your opinion and advice will be most welcome, even if its not the answer I want!
Thanks in advance.
Richard
Control Systems Company
Hi Streetwise
We are owed retention money on a construction project..
A stubborn electrical contractor is refusing to pay a retention that is well past it’s due date. The reason he states is that the main contractor (MC) has gone bust owing him all retention monies. He was sub-contracted to the MC and we were sub-contracted to him.
He is saying that in construction law if the MC goes bust the sub-contractor does not have to pay his sub-contractors.
Is this the case or is he spinning a line?
Nurse Call Systems Installer
We mainly specialize in small residential works such as extensions and refurbishments and sign contracts directly with owners of properties.
Does Construction Act 2011 changes relate only to sub-contractors or can it also be used in our particular case when the contractor is not a limited company and deals with owners of the properties?
Regards
Alex
Construction Minister Michael Fallon announces team that will work with Government on the Industrial Strategy for construction.
The eighteen strong advisory council has been put together by Government Chief Construction Adviser Peter Hansford who is leading the formation of the strategy and will chair the group.
Fallon says; “Construction is a sector where Government and business working together can have a real impact. It can drive productivity and growth in other parts of the economy.”
What should the industry expect from this Advisory Council?
We are a new specialist flooring sub contractor. We are trying to negotiate credit terms with a new supplier. It’s not easy – I’m sure you know.
We need to use this supplier for a £300k contract we have with a very credit worthy client. The materials we need to buy from this supplier is around the £100k value mark.
I’m going down the line of proposing to this supplier that they allow us Net 60 days for all the materials, we put all materials on site and claim them in our first valuation.
My question is; generally speaking, should a contractor accept this or should I discuss this with them first?
Any thoughts are welcome.
Best regards
Paul
When is an amount due to be paid actually deemed to have been paid. Is it :-
a) When the subby gets a Payment Notice from the MC or
b) The date for payment (if any) shown on that payment notice or
c) the date the money gets paid into his bank account so he has use of the money or
d) Some other date
If the MC pays by cheque again is it:-
a) When the subby gets the cheque
or
b) When the cheque clears and the subby can use the money or
c) Some other date
On one recent job the Main Contractors QS said that they did not have to release the first moiety of the retention they are holding on the subcontract works until they receive PC from the Client for their works.
I said this sounded unfair and was told that this is how it is.
Could you please confirm that the Main Contractor should release 50% of the retention held once the subcontractors work is completed satisfactorily. The remaining 50% to be released after the end of the “Defects Liability Period.”
This is irrespective of whether the Main Contractor has PC on his whole works. Otherwise lets say a piling subcontractor on the Shard would have to wait a number of years to get his first 50% retention released until the Main Contractor finishes the whole building.
F Park QS
Dear Streetwise
When quoting / bidding for a domestic subcontract package through a main contractor – does the main contractor have the right not to disclose the range or list of subcontract prices received or can he state that this information is strictly confidential?
Simon Roy Concrete Repairs
Hi Streetwise: We did not finish a job for a company as we were getting messed about, so when they called and asked us to attend the following week we said that we couldn’t as we were on another job.
Three weeks later we received a letter saying we were in breach of contract and that we would have to cover any additional charges for alternative subcontractors to carry out the remaining works.
They estimated that it would be £5,000 to complete the works, they have now said that it actually cost £17,000 to complete and we now owe them £12,000!
The original contract value was £16,000 so we cannot understand how they can say it cost a further £17,000.
We do have a contract/order from them but we never had to sign a copy and return.
Please advise what we can do?
I have belatedly taken responsibility for a contract and I am concerned about the current contractual position.
The job is approx. 45% complete and was scheduled to be handed over July 2011 and is now c. 6 months late. I believe that a claim had been submitted for EOT several months ago and failed, which is astonishing given the circumstances and will have to look into the detail.
The issue would appear to have been left to fester and has remained unchallenged for months.
Currently we have no revised contract programme or agreed end date from the main contractor as he is claiming he can’t produce one until he gets clarification from the client (which is an invalid reason as far as I am concerned, our contract is with the MC) and are working from what I can see to piecemeal unofficial sectional programmes and are basically at the mercy of the MC and spending the money.
We have not been paid any prelims since last February, not one variation has been agreed and the job is therefore effectively at large.
I believe that at one point we exercised our suspension rights under the contract (FIDIC with some domestic conditions) and withdrew our labour. This did not gain us anything and at best put us further behind in terms of the available access instead of keeping tight.
Clearly we need to get order back into proceedings, therefore any advice you can offer would be greatly appreciated.
Gordon Hill Qatar
Hi Streetwise
I have agreed vos with a clients QS and had response back to say agreed, but now the QS has left and a new QS has stepped in. He has now asked for more information and put them as on account payments.
What do I do?
Also I have another contract which was for 44 weeks and we are now in week 64. Can I claim for extra hire and supervision costs ? I have emailed them on week 50 requesting this but have not had any amswer.
Hope you can help. Good site by the way.
Regards Richard Wattam
Arc Force Ltd
We are carrying out a project where an overall programme was agreed
Subsequently several weeks into the project The main contractor introduced a Target Programme which they have not met
In contract law where does a target programme sit. I presume that the the inital agreed programe is the over riding legal document
Joe
ATC Electrical
Throughout our contract period, our Method Doc was changed to accommodate restrictions of access imposed by the main contractor. Eventually during the progress of the works a methodology was agreed but resulted in a reduction in the content of the testing work.
Post completion and post submission of our documentation , our client has taken the view that our Fixed price Order is now redundant and that he now has the right to modify our contract to a day rate Order based upon his personal appraisal of the time and our costs expended on site . Naturally he has chosen to bullishly ignore management time, supervisory site attendance and our loss of profit and overhead. Our time on site equates to 72% of our maximum time allowance.
We responded initially with a Without prejudice calculated good will offer to settle for 81% of the value for prompt payment, whilst maintaining our entitlement to the full order value.
There has been no dialogue written or otherwise regarding financial reductions during the course of the works.
We now take that the view the full amount is due as we and they made a commercial decision in pricing and their acceptance of our Quotation.
Are we correct in maintaining entitlement
Regards
Rick
Commissioning Specialists
I am owed a significant amount of retention for various projects for the same Contractor. The total amounts to approx £25k, made up of amounts £25k average. The oldest project is over 3 years ago, the most recent approx 2 years. What is the best way to recover this money if the Contractor either fails to respond or rejects my claim by saying he has not recieved End of Defects/Final Payment from the (his) clients? Andy McDonough Peterborough
We have undertaken a £1.9M M&E COntract for a main builder and at Final account stage (after releiving the majority of the project team of their positions) the Main Contractor’s Commercial Director has set about the Draft Final Account with a vengeance and is citing the Client and the M&E consultant as the reasons for the ‘reductions’.
The work was a design and build contract with a performance specification.
It has dragged on for months and I would like to escalate the process but am not sure which way is best to proceed.
To make matters works, we offered an additional 2.5% discount for 30days payment and he has not once paid on 30days – Am I within my rights to remove this ‘discount’ on my draft final account.
(Regrettably I was not involved at the outset or during this project, just picking up the pieces!) – Any advice would be appreciated.
Joe Makepeace
M&E Contractor
Hi Streetwise
We are working for a Contractor who has deducted monies for cleaning up amounting to over £8k no clean up notices were issued nor any proof of the works having been carried out are they allowed to do this?
We have had the monies taken from our valuations before they are paid.
What advice can you give us?
Clive May
C May Brickwork Ltd
Streetwise
We have recieved a collateral warranty for one of our projects using the JCT 2005 Sub-contractor collateral warranty document. We are fine with all of the terms with regards to workmanship, however we used an external designer for the works.
We are being asked to sign for the design competancy, are we able to list the designer within the agreement, or do we need to raise our own internal collateral warranty against the designer?
You assistance would be much appreciated.
Richard Orry WBS Nottingham
Hi Streetwise
We bought some profiled metal roofing sheets from Phoenix Fabrications for a job carried out some time ago. Interserve have paid us, we have paid Phoenix however phoenix went into administration last week not having paid their coil supplier, Coilcolor.
We are trying to get the product guarantee from Coilcolor however they are saying that they do not issue guarantees until they have received payment, which now looks unlikely. Where does this leave us, Interserve and the Client? Is there any consumer legislation that we can rely on or are Coilcolor within their rights to refuse?
Eddie Ford Rooksby Roofing
Hi Streetwise
We employ approximately 50 staff and our existing offices are effectively based in three adjacent old converted houses.
We are reviewing our fire assessment, evacuation and emergency procedures and want to ensure we incorporate appropriate procedures for Disabled people.
We don’t currently have any disabled staff or generally have disabled visitors and have not made any building changes to accomodate disable visitors. Can you advice what we reasonably need to do to satisfy our legal obligations, given there has been no practical issue to date in this regard?
Martin Hartley
Argus Fire
Hi Streetwise,
Can you recommend a good source of information on negotiating?
Derek Turnbull
Ceramic Tiling Contractors Lewisham
Streetwise can you help?
We have just received a letter from a Contractor telling us that he intends to deduct £65,000 from our account because we have delayed the job.
This is the first time we have heard of any problem!
What should we do?
Peter Hall
Joiners Solihull
Streetwise
We have been instructed by a Contractor to carry out additional work but his instruction says “This Instruction Does Not Necessarily Constitute A Variation To Your Contract or Entitle you To Payment”. We are concerned we aren’t going to get paid. Do we have to carry out the additional works?
Jeff Stone – Specialist Roofing Contractors Birmingham
Hello Streetwise,
We are electrical contractors working mostly on large commercial schemes, but we have recently become involved in a housing development which has “penalties” for not completing on time. We have heard of “liquidated damages”. Are there ay differences?
John Antrebus,
Electrical Contractors Leeds.
Question #1
Dear Streetwise,
On a recent contract, the Contractors Contract manager agreed to provide some minor items of hired in plant and I agreed that they could deduct the cost from the final account.
They duly provided copy invoices, with which I am in full agreement, but the QS has also added a 20% mark up, justifying this by saying that as I mark up anything I provide, so can he.
Can he do this? Should he be doing this?
The QS has also said that he will only release my final payment if and when I send him a credit for the full amount, including the 20%. I have so far only sent him a credit for the nett amount + VAT.
The Contract Manager has confirmed over the phone today, that he agreed to provide the plant at nett cost, but he has since left the Contractor.
The 20% only amounts to a couple of hundred quid and the final payment is about £10K, but the phrase “thin end of the wedge” comes to mind.
The QS is a blustering, unpopular bully (you probably wont be too surprised to hear!), who I dont get on with. He had to agree in advance to some accelleration costs, to get us to accelerate at very short notice and now says that as I “held him to ransom, its payback time.” I should point out that he passed the acceleration costs onto the client and didnt have to stand them himself!
Your opinion and advice will be most welcome, even if its not the answer I want!
Thanks in advance.
Richard (Control Systems Company)
Question #1 - Answer
Hi Richard
Your problem highlights the importance of agreeing everything clearly in writing! That way the doubt that now surrounds who agreed what, would be removed.
You do not say “why” you agreed that they would provide the plant, or whether it was used for your original contract works, a specific variation, or indeed to facilitate the acceleration.
If the Contract’s Manager is prepared to give you a Witness Statement that the plant was to be provided at nett cost then that is the best evidence you can get under the circumstances. If he isn’t then it’s your word against there’s.
In the overall scheme of things it might be simpler, and indeed more economical to accept that that particular battle isn’t worth fighting and concentrate on the all important issue of getting paid.
As regards payment;
- The QS does not need a credit note to value your works.
- Your entitlement to payment stems from the contract, and the QS can’t unilaterally decide “when” payment will be made.
- If this is a “Construction Contract” as defined by the Construction Act then there are various provisions that should help you to get paid, but in oreder to find the solution, we need a few more facts.
The bottom line is that you are entitled to be paid and we can help you resolve that situation. Please take a look at our Entry Level Membership, and I will give you a call shortly.
Question #2
We recently undertook an air-conditioning installation for XXX, on a Primark. During the commissioning stage of the project, when our equipment was powered up, we noted the 2 of the PCB’s within the units we installed had been damaged.
We informed XXX, and they gave us a written instruction to proceed with the rectification works, however looking back the email was quite brief – cost to be agreed etc
We undertook the rectification works, at a cost of £4k, added the variation to our invoice and issued it to XXX.
We then issued photos of the damage to the manufacturer of the equipment who confirmed that the damage was caused by an electrical connection fault – We did not undertake any electrical connections. We passed this on XXX to prove that their appointed electrical contractor had damaged the A/C units.
Over the last 2 months, we have exchanged a number of emails with XXX, detailing our argument and evidence, and today they have written back to us confirming that the feel the blame lies with the equipment manufacturer and we should look to the equipment manufacturer to claim our monies back….
This equipment manufacturer is Mitsubishi Electric, a multi billion pound world wide organisation, who don’t send faulty equipment out of their factories.
Can you advise me on any next steps we can take to claim the monies owed to us?
Mark Fairhurst
Question #2 - Answer
Hi Mark
Firstly, I would agree that the likelihood of the units having been supplied defective is almost nil. However, do you have any test documentation or quality control documentation, or any other evidence that confirms that the equipment was in full working order when installed?
If you do then that is very useful evidence to prove that they were damaged post installation.
Secondly, do you know what XXX’s motivation is for seeking to not pass these costs on to their appointed electrical contractor? Indeed is there any evidence that they have even sought to do so?
If you can show that they have an ulteria motive for not doing so, then that is again useful evidence to have.
As regards the solution, then it seems to me that it is time to escalate the matter and demonstrate to XXX that you arserious about recovering your £4k. However, as the work has been carried out as a variation to a much larger contract, then I would need to see the terms of the contract before I can advise you further.
Please feel free to give me a call on 01773 712116 for some initial free advice.
Best regards
Barry
Question #3
We have a sub-contract with a main contractor under which we are fitting a product specified by the architect .
The ultimate client is stating that the product is not fit for purpose, even though the manufacturer ourselves and the main contractor have proven that the product supplied and fitted is fit for purpose.
Subsequently the supplier of the goods has spoken to the ultimate client directly and cannot agree a solution. As a result the supplier has fallen out with the client and subsequently has offered us a credit for the materials only and is now stating that the goods are now his and he is within his rights to remove them from site even though the materials are fixed.
Removing the materials will cause serious consequences.
My question is this: Is the supplier legally entitled to take fixed materials off the site? in addition we have not necessarily accepted the suppliers credit note.
Gary Bigg
Specialist Cladding Contractor
Question #3 - Answer
Hi Gary
It’s an interesting question and one that involves a very well established legal principle. That principle being;
“What’s fixed to the land belongs to the land.”
In other words fixing almost anything on a construction project means that the land owner now owns whatever has been fixed, irrespective of whatever else anyone’ contractual arrangements might be, and irrespective of whether or not anyone has been paid.
So, removing the materials would be both theft and an act of criminal damage!
The question of fitness for purpose and what could and should be done is much more involved and we would need more information to be able to comment further.
Please feel free to give me a call for some initial free advice on 01773 712116.
Best regards
Barry
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